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This is what you promised us, Mr Cameron - News - The News

I've changed the word "Artic" in the thread title to "Arctic", not out of pedantry but just so that anyone searching for the subject with a view to contributing can find the thread more easily.

Originally Posted by soleil

I've changed the word "Artic" in the thread title to "Arctic", not out of pedantry but just so that anyone searching for the subject with a view to contributing can find the thread more easily.

Fairly sure no-one has any truck with correcting the thread title. Two posters have alluded to this already, so the juggernaut of opinion made it inevitable, I s'pose.

Should we be surprised that Cameron has not fulfilled his support, after all he's a politician?

Originally Posted by finknottle

Should we be surprised that Cameron has not fulfilled his support, after all he's a politician?

Finks - you really should read more widely before jumping on the outrage bus. Cameron has stated that he is leaving the decision to the appropriate authorities. He has not said he doesn't support the bid simply that it is up to the review committee to make their assessment and he has no intention of interfering in the process. Perhaps he should interfere or perhaps he shouldn't but you cannot take what the various meeja say as gospel!!!

Originally Posted by broadside

Finks - you really should read more widely before jumping on the outrage bus. Cameron has stated that he is leaving the decision to the appropriate authorities. He has not said he doesn't support the bid simply that it is up to the review committee to make their assessment and he has no intention of interfering in the process. Perhaps he should interfere or perhaps he shouldn't but you cannot take what the various meeja say as gospel!!!

broadside, I am not even at the bus stop. Cameron must have an opinion on the matter and as PM he should put his shoulders in the horizontal and make his opinion clear.

The WW2 Medals award qualifying arrangements were not that selective regarding areas served .
The Atlantic Star especially was given to all units that spent time within that area of conflict and the award of the 1939-45 Star
was one of the pre-requisites .
The Arctic convoys muster point usually began in the North Atlantic prior to sailing and Escort Ships took the Merchant ships from there
to the Russian destination.
Yes it was an area of hardship with attacks by enemy forces including Uboats, Aircraft and also occasional surface warships.
However it wasn't unique --the Atlantic and Meditteranean were equally areas of harship and enemy action.
A few details -Allied ships to Russia
1941 64 ships -in 8 convoys losses 1
1942 256 ships in 13 convoys losses 63
1943 112 ships in 6 convoys losses 4
1944 284 ships in 9 convoys losses 7
1945 95 ships in 4 convoys losses 6
Yes the weather was cold etc and the hardest part was the berthing facilities in Russia-No runs ashore like the Amerca's
Coastal hot spots .
The Russian war commemoration medals given were a token of gratitude and to extend the thanks of the Russian people .
The 1939-45 great Patriotic War is revered in Russia -their Rememberance day is 8th May each year -the day the war
ceased in Europe 1945.

Hope it helps --war isn't easy and my Father was just glad to come home unharmed------he was Merchant Navy and
I eventually found out his war history and medals entitlement he never claimed them or spoke about his time away during WW2

G

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Greenie,

BZ to your father, and to all others who served under those horrendous conditions.

My reading of the situation is that the PM, (well aware of his promise but probably frustrated with the MOD’s tight ‘rules’ and prolonged review) has recently directed that a separate independent inquiry shall now investigate and recommend if/when an Arctic Medal should be awarded.


But - Wherever did you obtain your convoy figures as they are considerably less than those listed at Wiki?

<<… The Arctic convoys of World War II travelled from the United Kingdom and North America to the northern ports of the Soviet Union—Arkhangelsk and Murmansk.

There were 78 convoys between August 1941 and May 1945 (although there were two gaps with no sailings between July and September 1942, and March and November 1943).

About 1400 merchant ships delivered vital supplies to the Soviet Union under the Lend-Lease program, escorted by ships of the Royal Navy, Royal Canadian Navy, and the U.S. Navy.

Eighty-five merchant vessels and 16 Royal Navy warships (two cruisers, six destroyers, eight other escort ships) were lost.

The Nazi German Kriegsmarine lost a number of vessels including one battleship, three destroyers and at least 30 U-boats as well as a large number of aircraft...>>



Separately, (Leningrad aside) I have often wondered how much difference the contents of those convoys actually made to the war on the eastern front, given the huge size of the two armies engaged there. Or were they merely/partly a sop to Stalin’s continual demands for the allies to open up a campaign on the western front much earlier than the 1944 Normandy invasion?